Local group gives money to county to fight asphalt plant
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Joseph T.
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Posted 10:14 pm, 07/31/2019
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has to be some kind of trick since I am pretty sure Radford quarry's isn't bankrupt Watch for the county to end up paying for that.
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jrscott295
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Posted 2:44 am, 07/31/2019
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Seems the quarry is filing for bankruptcy due to some quarter million in owed lawyer fees due to the county dragging this on and on, stuff like this is why Ashe County is not attractive to business.
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aFicIoNadoS
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Posted 12:34 pm, 07/29/2019
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And Lunker, we've already covered that the county can't just go around buying up property of businesses that some think is a bad business. Even if it's legal to do so, it's not a precedent that one wants to open up. Every time someone thinks a business is negative, they will expect the nanny state to buy it. And you still ignore the fact that doing so would be endorsing and protecting a monopoly, which is illegal.
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Lurker2
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Posted 11:41 am, 07/29/2019
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Scott - this was my original comment and I am not part of a group of idealistic ****:
"The County can always accept donations.
The County can always turn down donations.
The County should always accept doantions to help the County.
The County should always turn down donations that are in fact an invitation to piss away a lot of money.
Ashe County had a chance to deal with this issue many decades ago and chose to do nothing. The only way to "win" this is for the County to pay a defacto ransom - that is to buy the land where the plant would be and hold it for some future public purpose. That's going to be **** expensive since the land is no longer rural but commercial/industrial with a measurable revenue stream."
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Lurker2
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Posted 11:37 am, 07/29/2019
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Scott, there is a difference between advocating for something to be done and explaining how to do something.
I don't think I have said that I think the plant should be stopped. What I've said is how you stop such things if you are so inclined.
I can come up with dozens of ways to poison your dog but that doesn't mean you should poison your dog.
The unwillingness or inability to address problems at their source means you are always responding to symptoms of a problems or negative externalities - after the fact. The County could have prevent an asphalt plant had they had the brains to do so before this one started the permitting process. They chose not to take action.
Action after the fact is very, very expensive.
In this particular case the County would need to determine something along the lines of a need for parking and an access point for the River between Elk Shoals and NC 16 bridge - an access point that accommodates more than just a few people jumping into the river. Then they have to be willing to pay for the land acquisition to complete the project. It's easy to establish the public purpose for taking that particular land out of industrial usage, what's not easy is paying for the land and some measure of future lost revenue.
We both know the County will do nothing but dither.
And you are correct that proper screening and dust and odar mitigation can result in you not knowing the plant is there - other than the trucks you could have hidden it all. Of course the trucks are another matter and traffic and trucks are something else the County has not addressed.
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Lurker2
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Posted 11:23 am, 07/29/2019
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Fins, you need to quit those opioids or sober up.
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jrscott295
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Posted 1:29 am, 07/29/2019
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Just so you know Hooters changed their uniforms and they don't wear what you describe now.
There is already a quarry at that site, it's going to be real hard (impossible) to convince a court that the asphalt plant would have a hindrance to the local economy. In fact I used to live less than a quarter mile from the one on 16 and if you didn't know it was there you wouldn't have known. So all this fear you and your buddies stir up is largely unfounded.
It's amazing that you think a new 4 lane road is needed to bring in more tourist but don't think a business that will help build and maintain that road is necessary......
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jrscott295
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Posted 1:25 am, 07/29/2019
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We need to find a way to get more people to run for County Commissioner and just clean house after all this ity. If only it wasn't so hard for someone not in the GOP or the Democrats to run.
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aFicIoNadoS
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Posted 11:06 pm, 07/28/2019
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Stupi, you are the one that suggested the county could buy property to stop a business and then brought up condemnation. Now you are back pedaling since you've been smacked around for being completely full of ****.
I rarely spend my time trying to tutor the ignorant. I feel it's your job to help yourself. But this one time, I'll do you a favor
https://www.merriam-webster...rogression
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Lurker2
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Posted 9:58 pm, 07/28/2019
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Fins "Sue the school that gave you degrees, because they clearly handed them out without making sure you learned anything. A county can't stop a business as long as that business meets all required laws. This asphalt plant has already done that. Contrary to what your communist indoctrinators led you to believe, property can't be condemned to stop a business. That's not progression. Especially when doing so would protect a monopoly.
All experts have explained in detail that the county cannot win this lawsuit"
Fins confuses stopping a business with the condemnation of land for a public purpose. He thinks they are the same thing when they are not. I don't know if that is a purposeful lie or just poor intelligence.
I don't know what "progression" is. It's not a legal term.
Where is this monopoly? And how does the element of monopoly have to do with condemning land for a public purpose?
Fins doesn't seem to understand the law, but claims he then ne resorts to name calling and McCarthyite tactics.
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Lurker2
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Posted 9:52 pm, 07/28/2019
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Fins, why is when you lose an argument you resort to name calling and subject changing?
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aFicIoNadoS
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Posted 6:34 pm, 07/28/2019
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Sue the school that gave you degrees, because they clearly handed them out without making sure you learned anything. A county can't stop a business as long as that business meets all required laws. This asphalt plant has already done that. Contrary to what your communist indoctrinators led you to believe, property can't be condemned to stop a business. That's not progression. Especially when doing so would protect a monopoly.
All experts have explained in detail that the county cannot win this lawsuit. Yet they keep dumping money down a hole to fight it. Most people are mad that they are knowingly wasting money.
Leave the complicated stuff to the grown ups.
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Lurker2
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Posted 5:55 pm, 07/28/2019
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And fins, when the clever government wants to shut down a business after the fact, they use the health department and the inspections department.
The most powerful person in the County is the Chief Building Inspector. He has the power to immediately shut down a business. The Health Department is next, but since it's a combined situation in Ashe, that power is not solidly in the hands of the county.
Government has many tools, but like all tools it takes skill to use the tools effectively. Purchasing the land in question to make an overflow parking area for Glendale Springs and tourists to the river is a valid exercise of condemnation. So is condemnation of the land for a park or to protect the New River. But as I've tried to explain to you before, the County has to be willing to pay for price, not do it on the cheap.
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Lurker2
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Posted 5:48 pm, 07/28/2019
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Olejoe,
You make an excellent point. The vast majority of the County probably does not care. Of course they have the "right" to build it, but that right can be taken away like any other right with due process and proper compensation.
The real issue is what is the value of Glendale Springs as a tourist trap for the County and will the plant negatively affect those businesses. The new business is not starting in a vacuum. The asphalt plant is akin to having a Hooters open up in the middle of West Jefferson with the girls wearing just enough nipple coverage to slip the law.
In a representative democracy, the people elect people to make decisions on their behalf - theoretically. They don't elect them to take polls and ask everyone their opinion, I can't say if there will be a negative impact, but for $10K I can write you a study that comes out either way.
In a sense the client in this case is not the County taxpayer as the potential tourist versus the positive impact of the plant.
It's a shame the County did not use their watershed protection ordinance combined with a pollution mitigation ordinance to impose odor controls on the plant. If you don't see it or smell it, a lot of things are okay.
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Lurker2
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Posted 5:39 pm, 07/28/2019
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Fins, a couple of my advanced degrees are in those subjects. Your insults are weak. The cut and paste is for those who want a link or citations and are wise enough not to take everything at face value just because someone like you claims it to be so.
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aFicIoNadoS
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Posted 5:33 pm, 07/28/2019
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Lunker, the government can't condemn a property to shut down a business. You clearly don't understand all that you cut and paste. Especially with a business that provides a needed service, like paved roads. It's clear that you failed poli sci and Econ.
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olejoe
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Posted 5:15 pm, 07/28/2019
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Lurker, you seem to think the majority of the county is opposed to the asphalt plant. I'm not sure that is the case, most folks I talk with believe they have the right to build.
Shouldn't all of the citizens of the county be considered when it is our tax dollars the BOC is squandering?
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Lurker2
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Posted 3:51 pm, 07/28/2019
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Scott,
The County need not defend its past ity and past attempts to defraud the owners of the property. The County can move forward in an attempt to take the property and the only salient issue is paying the owners for what the County has taken.
Once the quarry people figured out that Ashe failed to close the barn door, they fled the barn as any smart business would. To get them back into the barn, the County has to pay. It's that unwillingness to pay that is at odds with the Framer's intent and State law.
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Lurker2
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Posted 3:45 pm, 07/28/2019
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Scott,
I have no doubt that the County would attempt to do it with a ham-fisted approach worthy of the dumbest rube you can find at Hardees in the early morning.
However, if they had sense, and a willingness to pay, they would take all the quarry property along with a strip of land necessary to access the river. Since this would be a package of parcels - three parcels and two owners, the action could very well stand especially if someone gets creative with the adjacent low water bridge. This is a level of creativity that escapes most people. Then on top of that you have to have the elected board, the planning board, and the county staff to keep their fool mouths shut about what is really happening.
Legal fictions occur all the time, you don't have to be in moral agreement with them.
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