ashe

OCM in your experience is the preparation, review and approval of the annual budget an open process. By open I mean is it ever made public by some manner other than the board meetings. I understand towns may be different than counties and vary from place to place but it seems that control of the purse strings is essential for the citizens.

City, In one of your posts you say that if a board member "forgets that when they stick their nose into things as an individual they have none of the legal protections that they have as the "Board". Can you expand on that some please? I don't know very much about government and I'm not sure I understand.

If you think any of what the dog says is ignorant, then you still don't get it.

I don't always agree with what Underdog has to say and some of his stuff is just ignorant but I agree that this forum is usually dead on with exposing dirty little secrets in our county and has had a major part in getting messes cleaned up. There are not too many people who post on here but it is widely read. I first saw the slogan "Price and Poe must go" on here. Then on bumper stickers. Then the outcome was clear that everyone had paid attention. Same with the assistant manager. I hear too many people talking about what is exposed on here for it to not matter.

I once worked for a 9 member council. Anything big or disturbing or controversial, I went to see them in groups of two or one on one before a subcommittee meeting. Before the meeting they had lunch. A lunch they would ******* chat. We even fed the media. All that was off the record.

At the subcommittee meeting itself, actual presentations were made. Usually the board had already seen the presentation. This gave them time not to look stupid or uninformed. They would discuss and then decide whether or not to send it to the Council meeting.

Nearly everything at the Council meeting was pro-forma. Very few issue were divisive or up in the air by that point. Public comments were usually bland and not helpful. Once in a while something came up where something new came out at the Council meeting - when that happened the issued was kicked to the next meeting.

Anything with legal ramifications, any bad news, any bad rumors, any economic development stuff, and internal disagreements between staff were handled in private at a closed session and the board would get a general consensus before going back to the public.

Most of that is "illegal", but it allows to address the rumors of who is having sex with whom at the Jail, WWTP, City Hall, in the Police Cars, etc., without ruining reputations because most rumors are crap. It also allows to or more department heads to air real differences of opinion in front of the board without worrying about what the public hears. This is when you find out who did what stupid at the Sewer Plant, or messed up someone's property, etc., etc. It also allows the Board to cuss each other out when they are not getting along.

Secrecy in closed session lasted about 90 minutes after the meeting broke up as the councilmen told wives and wives told the world.

If two board members are being left out of the info flow - they need to state that in public at a meeting. That takes the manager off the hook with the other three. If the two do not complain in public, they are complicit.

Sometimes a board member is not able to functionally work - alzheimers, etc., etc. Dealing with them can be difficult and sometimes the board cuts them out of the loop.

Sometimes it's just as simple as giving a contract to the majority's buddies. When it's that, that's the American way at work.

I have opposed my past boards in private many times. Even told them they were crazy or stupid or breaking the law. Sometimes they AGREED with me, but did things anyway for political reasons.

It's against the ICMA code of ethics for me to castigate them in public. It's against the ICMA code to show up at WJ Town Hall or the Courthouse and interject my professional opinion.

Two times I was dragged into a meeting of another elected body because I happened to be there - both times was to mediate an argument that had run off the rails and both sides were mad at their manager and wanted a supposed unbiased opinion. Both times my presence was noted in the media and my own Board was pissed off that I was caught in public. In both cases the City Attorney was not present for those small boards and they looked out into the audience and saw me.

At this stage of life if I were to do some work for Ashe County, Jefferson, WJ, Boone, BR, etc., it would have to be under the clear understanding that I am the benevolent dictator and will not be interfered with until the task is finished. No micro managing, no calling me at all hours of the day and night, no stupid question in public.

And the more you care about a community, the harder it is to remain professional.

ocm that town board sounds just like what we have here. 3 puppets that cant see the benefits of a college. They continue to pour money in a air field for a few rich pricks to come in for the weekend while questioning every penny of other departments.

Heels is dead on what the manager should be doing. However its not going to happen nor has it been happening. Its as plain as the nose on your face three are discussing county business with the manager and among themselves. The head nut has stated on numerous occasions he goes to see the manager almost daily.

We don't see any evidence that he is capable. When he's ask a question, he never gives an informed answer. I don't doubt the back room meetings, however I have pointed out a view times that these newly elected commissioners ran on transparency.

Heels, I appreciate your idealism. However, you have to fix the blame at the source. The election of a stupid politician is the fault of the voters. The choice of the voters. It's the voters that have to change to change the quality of folks elected to government.

Heels, how do you know WHAT the County Manager tells the majority in private? He could be telling them everything and they ignore him.

I once worked for a set of idiots who had the Town wells contaminated with E.coli, Coliform,. Formaldyhide, and two or three other nasty things leaching from old furniture plants. Those dumb***es were too stupid to understand that the State of NC was going to pay for the Town to buy water from another town by paying for a 12 mile transmission line - the town would have owned a 12 mile transmission line and been able to sell water to customers for 12 miles.

It failed on a 3-2 vote because they were so ignorant they were obsessed that a dead horse had been found in the other town's raw water reservoir. They were too dumb to understand the difference between treated and raw water.

I quit in two week because I would not sell contaminated water to people.

I did all I could do - the local media knew - the local media reported, Nothing was done until the Town tossed the three out of office.

Yes, I have stated he works for the board. Many people have jobs working for those in decision making positions. My point is its his job to inform them of all aspects of a decision and the impact of that decision. As we are seeing, any idiot can shake his head and say yes master. It takes someone who knows what he's doing to provide facts and help them come to an informed decision.

And since they read this, Mr. Rhodes - move back from the microphone. He is the only one that can NOT be clearly heard.

Like we have been saying they all but admit they are breaking the law and dare us to try and do anything about it. The previous board met behind closed doors and came out and rubber stamped every item never discussing anything. This one has the three doing the meeting leaving the other 2 out.

Baskin - illegal meetings take place all the time in local government. If folks are worried about appearances you meet with less than a majority of the board or you shuttle them in an out of rooms. Heels - I didn't put words into your mouth. The Manager works for the Board, not the Citizens. He is not answerable to the Citizens. He works for the Board, and the Board has a majority. That means he works for the majority of the Board.

You may not like that. You may think it's unethical. But that's the reality. Trust me, it took me many, many years to adjust to the reality of the American system of local government. We don't live in a democracy. We live in a republic, and locally we live in municipal corporations, or State created creatures with either a charter or enabling legislation.

Local government in the US is corporate.

If 3 Board members tell the Manager not to tell something to the other 2, the Manager has his choices. Those with the majority vote have theirs. The only thing that enables a Manager to be outspoken or present issues that are anathema to the majority is a large severance penalty in an employment contract.

The only "problem" is that it is the public that elects their representatives. The public gets who they elect. Good or bad, ethical or crooked.

Clodhopper you yet prove once again your only comments on this site are only to troll. You are incorrect in your assumption that nothing has changed due to this site. Indeed it did and usually I would make an idiot like you look yourself but in your stupid case I will point it out to you plain and simple.

The manager tried to make an assistant manager and we stopped him.

You all sure do worry a lot over things you have no control over. I have yet to see where any of your whining has solved any of the so called issues you seem to find in your local gov't.. Seems to me you are wasting your breath, or in this case typing skills on something you will never change.

Ocm, it's illegal for a majority of more of the board to meet privately with the manager. That's been one of the other problems going on

OCM, I never said he should argue. Don't put words in my mouth. What I said was he should present both sides of the issues , provide the information on pros and cons of both sides to give the commissioners and the public the information needed to make an informed decision. It's not his job to pick sides, but determine the impact that each decision has on the county. He not an elected official, he has a job to do.

Shucks, these folks cant handle good managers. they fires the last two good ones, McMillian and Mitchell. If they want a good manager who knows all the ins and outs of county government, they should hire McMillan back.

City, that only works if ALL the board members are receiving the same information. That clearly isn't the case here as evidenced by some of the board members asking in a public meeting why they hadn't received certain information that other board members did. Seems to be that should be covered in your ethics policies as well.

Heels, one more thing. As the Manager, you never surprise your Board in public. That means you brief them in private before the meeting. In that briefing, if a solid majority say "don't talk about "X", again you have a couple of choices. If you have children or a mortgage, you tend to do what the majority say.