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shoe shine I would call it the truth.

You sir...have one **** of a God Complex.

Dog, not only do they use services, they buy commercial property. I had one buy 4 acres next to a Home Depot/Wal Mart - I should have had 12-20 million of taxable value on that parcel and instead we got the daycare that came with the church and the complaints by the church folk about the commercial traffic. That's a 60K to 100K loss a year for every single year.

Churches and other town/county/state entities should not have their facilities in valuable commercial property. Boone is a terrible offender - they have Town Hall, Public Works, Fire Department and the Police Department all on commercial property.

All of this raises the issue of paying for non-enterprise municipal services. I spent half a decade trying to explain to a dumb board that because the city was an employment center, the population in town spiked some 10K people between 8AM and 6 PM, and that the peak did not fully leave until 11 PM.

I once had a board member ask why people from the county came into town to rob stores - I told him jewelry, banks and beer did not grow on Tobacco or Soybean plants.

We should move away from property and income taxes and move to consumption taxes. However I do support ending tax free status, but not just for churches, for unions, PACs, etc. The IRS has used the tax code to infringe on the freedoms of religion and speech far to long, remove tax free status and let the churches etc teach as they will.

https://www.google.c...es?imgurl= http://g03.a.alicdn.com/kf/...imgrefurl= http://www.aliexpress.com/c...MwhAKBowGg

Way ahead of you boys. You should see what my nuns wear

Believe me I have thought about it for years. The church of dog.

Man ... am I ever in the wrong business. I need to get ordained and get in on this scam ... I mean gig!

Brings another thought to mind. The churches are using city and county services and yet are not paying dime for those services.

Joe, another point about that land claim from the English Crown, the Cherokee might want to dispute that claim as there were there first. ;)

There might be someone in Oklahoma or near Waynesville that has a better claim.

Actually the three documents that void allodial title are:

1. Articles of Confederation
2. Treaty of Paris with Great Britain
3. Constitution of United States

The Articles are the first formal government and form the perpetual union that exists today. In this document the questions of land ownership are left to the States. In the Treaty of Paris, Great Britain gives up all claims in land, however, Torry lands seized by the States were supposed to be given back to the owners but this was done probably in less than half the cases and one of the reasons so many left for Britain or Nova Scotia/Mew Brunswick. Under the Articles the Northwest Ordinance and another act laid out the ground rules for land sales in the United States from that point forward and it's the pattern until you hit some Spanish law stuff in Texas and California. In the Constitution the Federal Government is declared sovereign and has the power to take all your **** - your life, your happiness, and your land, with due process and with just compensation. The State could do it to you before the Constitution, no the Feds could do it to you, and to the States.

The reality is that you own nothing, You borrow, rent, squat, occupy, etc. You think you own something but as Jesus points out in a very oblique way, that's an illusion. True ownership comes only with Sovereignty and Perpetual Existence.

But there will always be nut jobs claiming to be ":Free Citizens" who don't want to pay taxes. The only reason we use property taxes as the basis for local taxation was because it was easy to control and keep straight in the 18th and 19th Century. The land could not drive to another state, and the cattle or pigs could be counted. No matter what other scheme is developed for taxation, someone has to pay the taxes.

Joe, in the United States only the Federal Government holds all the sticks and therefore the allodial title. The Articles of Confederation combined with the Constitution of the United States abrogates any such holdings on US Territory, and Congress has backed this up with Statute legislation.

To have allodial title you must be SOVEREIGN in a particular country. The closest thing to this in the United States is an Embassy protected by treaty or legal agreement between nations.

Sovereign is a step down from perpetual. A non-Baptist church (a joke), a private university, or a non-profit corporation, or a municipal corporation are set up to be perpetual, unlike you who will die.

In short, nothing the Crown gave your family counts for **** now.

OCM if you read the second part of my post again you will see where I posted pretty much what you just posted. However your comment about the queen brings up a interesting question. I know a couple of people who own land in this county that was granted to their family by the king of England. Why should they have to pay the county a tax on their land that they owned before the county or state even existed?

Good luck on that allodial title. Let me know where you find some. :)

Joe - a poor public education has led you to believe that you "own" property with all the so called bundle of sticks. You do not. You never have. Queen Elizabeth owns some land. The Federal government owns some land. Some churches and universities come close to owning land.

If you are no sovereign, you don't own your land outright and in total.

It's not the church, it's the members they want to tax.

Over and over and over and over. Period!

Take the first baptist church, the value is 1.7 million and Midway Baptist is 1.4 million. Just these two bible thumping properties the property tax would be over 100K for both.

I have always believe that no one should have to pay taxes on property they own. It has been shown time and time again that when the county Gov. has a pet project that they want to waste money on they just up everyone taxes over and over and over or they leave the tax rate alone and claim your property value went up.

If you don't pay this tax the county takes your property that you brought and paid for and sells it on the court house steps which means that you never really owned the property in the first place. It is really nothing but legal extortion.

The churches have forever gotten away with paying no property taxes on church owned property. That may soon end according to law makers in Raleigh. It couldnt happen soon enough.